r/politics 🤖 Bot Aug 12 '22 hehehehe 1 Wearing is Caring 1 Helpful 39 Take My Energy 2 Wholesome 28 Heartwarming 1 All-Seeing Upvote 1 Argentium 1 Bravo! 2 Mind Blown 1 Platinum 1 Silver 17 Burning Cash 1 Take My Money 1

Megathread: FBI Reportedly Discovers Classified Documents in Monday's Raid on Mar-a-Lago Megathread

While details are still accumulating and being confirmed, reportedly the FBI's raid earlier this week discovered classified documents at former president Trump's Florida residence.


Submissions that may interest you

SUBMISSION DOMAIN
Read the FBI's search warrant for Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago property usatoday.com
Trump lawyer blows up his “planted” evidence claims: Trump watched “the whole thing” on CCTV - Trump claims "nobody" was allowed to watch the FBI raid but he and his family watched through surveillance footage salon.com
Trump explodes on Truth Social over report that FBI targeted nuclear secrets at Mar-a-Lago salon.com
All the times Donald Trump has leaked classified information, including nuclear secrets FBI’s Mar-a-Lago search is not the ex-president’s first alleged run-in with respect to confidential information independent.co.uk
FBI collected multiple sets of classified documents from Trump's Mar-a-Lago home npr.org
FBI seized 'top secret' documents from Trump home apnews.com
This Is Insane': Search Warrant Indicates FBI Investigating Trump for Espionage Act Violation - "If you're not fed up," said watchdog group Public Citizen, "you're not paying enough attention." commondreams.org
Some Republicans express concern about Trump reportedly taking documents about nuclear weapons to Mar-a-Lago, even as they bash the FBI businessinsider.com
House GOP stands by Trump despite revelation FBI searched for nuclear documents washingtonpost.com
Here's What FBI Took From Trump's Mar-a-Lago, According to New Report newsweek.com
FBI took 11 sets of documents from Trump's home bbc.com
FBI pushes back against attacks over Trump search amid worries about violence thehill.com
FBI recovered 11 sets of classified documents in Trump search: report thehill.com
FBI removed top secret documents from Trump's home, WSJ reports reuters.com
FBI seized 11 sets of classified documents in Trump Mar-a-Lago raid nypost.com
GOP contorts itself in defense of Trump as new FBI search details emerge Republicans who days ago were near-united in blasting the Justice Department are allowing that nuclear weapons-related materials at Mar-a-Lago might be problematic. politico.com
Trump search: Top secret papers, Roger Stone clemency and Macron information among seized documents, report says independent.co.uk
FBI agents found dozens of classified documents in Mar-a-Lago search: sources thehill.com
‘He’s going to jail’: If Trump really had classified nuclear documents at his home, the consequences will be huge independent.co.uk
Trump Demands the DOJ Release the FBI Search Warrant…That He’s Had All Week vice.com
Trump could face espionage charges regarding nuclear documents taken to Mar-a-Lago peoplesworld.org
GOP backs Trump, escalates dark rhetoric after FBI search apnews.com
Evidence Suggests Trump Tried to Sell Out America for Profit dcreport.org
WSJ: FBI took 11 sets of classified docs from Mar-a-Lago, including some at highest classification level cnn.com
Trump Mar-a-Lago search warrant, property receipt show agents found trove of classified docs nbcnews.com
Trump admin-Saudi nuclear probe resurfaces ahead of warrant unseal newsweek.com
Trump Under Investigation For Violating Espionage Act, Search Warrant Shows - A copy of the warrant obtained by Politico also shows the former president is being investigated for removing or destroying records and obstructing an investigation. huffpost.com
Trump warrant papers list 11 sets of classified documents seized washingtonpost.com
Trump calls for ‘immediate release’ of Mar-a-Lago search warrant, says lawyers won’t oppose DOJ move thehill.com
MSNBC’s Beschloss, former CIA director Hayden ‘suggest’ Trump be executed for having nuclear documents foxnews.com
Trump Raid Documents Could Reveal Intel Sources on U.S. Payroll newsweek.com
The FBI recovered 11 sets of classified documents, including some marked top secret, from Mar-a-Lago: report businessinsider.com
DOJ Investigating If Trump Violated Espionage Act by Taking Records businessinsider.com
The FBI Retrieved ‘Top Secret’ Materials from Mar-a-Lago, Document Shows rollingstone.com
FBI seized a series of classified, "top-secret" materials in Mar-a-Lago search axios.com
Trump Doesn't Deny Taking Classified Nuclear Docs in New Statement businessinsider.com
Trump Loses It Over Nuclear Docs Report, Again Suggests 'Planted' Evidence rollingstone.com
Trump denies report that FBI sought nuclear documents during Mar-a-Lago search nbcnews.com
FBI took 11 sets of classified documents from Trump's Mar-a-Lago home, including some highly classified material amp.cnn.com
The warrant authorizing the FBI search on Trump’s home is unsealed — and it’s alarming vox.com
FBI search warrant reveals agents seized 'top secret' documents in raid of Trump's home cnbc.com
Trump, Supporters Say the FBI Planted Nuclear Secrets and Also That He Can Declassify Things With His Mind slate.com
Meet Judge Bruce Reinhart the magistrate who approved the FBI search warrant into Trump's Mar-a-Lago home receiving threats from MAGA supporters businessinsider.com
DOJ Cited Espionage Act in Trump Warrant; FBI Found Secret Files news.bloomberglaw.com
Read: DOJ’s warrant against Trump thehill.com
Trump denies storing nuclear weapons papers, accuses FBI of ‘planting information’ independent.co.uk
Editorial: Trump had nothing to hide from FBI - except ‘top secret’ government property houstonchronicle.com
Files seized by FBI from Trump’s home are part of espionage inquiry. nytimes.com
‘Was it nuclear? Heck, maybe it was aliens.’ Utah Rep. Chris Stewart defends Donald Trump, calls for details on documents seized from Mar-a-Lago. The FBI recovered ‘top secret’ documents from former President Donald Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home, according to the search warrant. sltrib.com
Read the full warrant documents from FBI search of Trump's Mar-a-Lago home npr.org
Read the warrant that allowed the FBI to search Trump’s Mar-a-Lago estate apnews.com
Read the FBI’s search warrant for Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home cnbc.com
Armed FBI attacker shot dead by police believed to be enraged Trump supporter. Ricky Shiffer appears to have posted about Mar-a-Lago raid on Trump platform Truth Social, and may have been at Capitol riot theguardian.com
Trump's Attorney Says He and His Family Watched the FBI Search in New York via Security Feed people.com
Mar-a-Lago Search Warrant Unsealed lawfareblog.com
Obama Kept 'Lots' of Nuclear Documents, Trump Says newsweek.com
Trump Lawyer Says He Watched Search On Camera, Muddling Claim That FBI Planted Evidence huffpost.com
Loner gunman who attacked FBI office was Navy vet who drove fast and was devoted to Donald Trump nbcnews.com
We thought Murdoch's news outlets were abandoning Trump. Then the FBI searched Mar-a-Lago cnn.com
On Trump’s Truth Social, anti-FBI sentiment builds with little oversight nbcnews.com
GOP Support for Trump Hits Record High After Fascist FBI Raid breitbart.com
Ex-Trump Aide Sics MAGA Fans on Alleged FBI Agents’ Families thedailybeast.com
Enraged Donald Trump Puts gun in Son Eric Trump's Mouth for leaking information to FBI in exchange for lighter sentence newsweek.com
The far right is calling for civil war after the FBI raid on Trump's home. Experts say that fight wouldn't look like the last one. businessinsider.com
GOP Trump supporters escalate dark rhetoric after FBI search pbs.org
Here's How Republicans Are Brushing Off The FBI Search Of Trump's Residence huffpost.com
The Memo: What the latest dramatic twists mean in the Trump-FBI saga thehill.com
Analysis: Responding to FBI search, Trump and allies return to his familiar strategy: flood the zone with nonsense cnn.com
Trump's 'Declassified' Defense After FBI Raid 'Is Going to Fail': McQuade newsweek.com
Trump warrant: Why did the FBI search Mar-a-Lago and what was found? bbc.com
Trump Lawyer Told Justice Dept. That Classified Material Had Been Returned, FBI found more during their raid. nytimes.com
‘It worried people all the time:’ How Trump’s handling of secret documents led to the FBI’s Mar-a-Lago search nbcnews.com
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u/Amon7777 Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Platinum Helpful Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote Take My Energy hehehehe Table Slap Evil Cackle

This is nearly the plot of a Tom Clancy novel executed by the cast of Tiger King.

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u/NotTheCraftyVeteran Aug 12 '22

America: “The Jan. 6 committee’s findings might be the thing that finally leads to criminal charges for Trump.”

Merrick Garland: “Guess what, motherfucker”

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u/ants_suck I voted Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Silver Helpful Wholesome Take My Energy

Since this is the current refrain, reminder on the following:

  1. The president CANNOT declassify documents relating to anything involving nuclear arms and technology.

  2. Declassified documents are still government property and CANNOT be taken home.

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u/SasparillaTango Aug 12 '22

also, there is a process for declassification, with an audit trail. The president doesn't get to just shout "I DECLARE THESE DECLASSIFIED"

also, ex-presidents can't declassify documents, so if they were classified when he left, it's been illegal this entire time.

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u/Konukaame Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan/status/1558168029766328320

Hold on, Breitbart just put out the names of the FBI agents who did the search? Are you kidding me? And presumably Breitbart got leaked this search warrant from Trump, unredacted?

Wow good luck to those agents & their families. Sheesh the right don’t give a damn about ‘the blue’.

Salon article

[Breitbart] also included the names of the individual FBI agents involved in the search. The court issued release of the warrant, which was approved Friday afternoon, redacts that sensitive information.

Team Trump just put a target on the backs of the agents and their families.

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u/Shaggy2772 Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote

That is 100% the intent

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u/BigBirdLaw69420 Aug 12 '22

Looks like those chuckle fuck traitors want to hit warp speed on the finding out part, which is going to echo in eternity.

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u/wolf_tree Aug 12 '22 Gold Wholesome Are You Winning?

Hey blue, do you feel backed?

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u/JDLovesElliot New York Aug 12 '22

Local cops don't care, they have an inferiority complex about the FBI. They're not their blue.

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u/koshgeo Aug 12 '22

The request to unseal the warrant that was submitted to the court by the DOJ mentioned that the names of the agents involved would be redacted if the warrant was released, so Trump's lawyers can't claim they "didn't know" it was important.

It's pure maliciousness.

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u/AustinBike Aug 13 '22

This may come back to bite him in the ass when he is before a judge.

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u/hypatianata Aug 12 '22

Not surprising.

PSA: Just a general reminder that Breitbart, known for its lack of standards, conspiracy-mongering, and bigotry-based articles, is an alt-right site (as proclaimed by its former executive chairman Steve Bannon circa 2016), not merely a “conservative” or “right-wing” site as often described by some news outlets.

“Alt-right” being a term coined by infamous neo-Nazi and anti-Semite Richard Spencer (of ‘punching Nazis’ and ‘Hitler salute’ fame, whose protégé, Stephen Miller, is best known for his cruelty-is-the-point immigration policies and sharing neo-Nazi literature among Trump’s White House employees) a rebranding for white nationalists to mainstream their ideas.

It’s basically the less in-your-face Daily Stormer for people who aren’t ready to accept the Nazi or white supremacist/nationalist/whatever label yet. Just in case anyone has gotten fuzzy about it.

So brown shirt-like stochastic terrorism is 100% in their wheelhouse.

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u/emptysoul365 United Kingdom Aug 12 '22 Silver

"The documents were planted by the FBI!"

"The documents were declassified!"

"Obama took lots of classified documents too!"

He's basically throwing shit at the wall at this point hoping something will stick.

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u/RonanTheAccused Aug 12 '22

No, he's just hoping his base will eat it up. And they will. They'll gladly ask for second servings of his horseshit.

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u/UWCG Illinois Aug 12 '22 Silver Wholesome Seal of Approval

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u/LatterTarget7 Aug 12 '22

Jesus Christ. They’re gonna get everyone.

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u/DoNotReply111 Australia Aug 13 '22

Jared's and Don Jnr's dirty prints will be all over this stuff.

And the best part is there is no legitimate reason whatsoever for them to be there. Lots of fifths will be pled that day.

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u/AWall925 Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote To The Stars

A good quote from the Youtuber Beau of the Fifth Column:

If you choose to stand behind this man politically after this, you never get to talk about supporting the troops again.

Because you're putting them at risk.

You never get to talk about wanting a strong country again.

Because you're weakening it.

You never get to talk about how diversity training is weakening the military.

Because nothing weakens it more than not being able to protect it's secrets.

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u/johnnyGotHisTabla Wyoming Aug 13 '22

Beau of the Fifth Column:

Well, howdy there, Internet person.

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u/henke Georgia Aug 12 '22

It’s absolutely bonkers that a few days ago we were speculating which of the many crimes of the former President were the reason for the raid. Turns out there’s also a brand new extremely serious crime that we weren’t aware he committed.

What a bizarre timeline. Can this fucker be locked up already?

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u/Warhawk137 Connecticut Aug 12 '22

Probably be quicker to list the crimes he hasn't committed.

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u/crono14 Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Helpful Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote

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u/AbstractLogic Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

He has an executive grant of clemency for Roger Stone and a folder labeled “FrenchPresident”.

Weird.

edit Follow up question: why would the FBI use ambiguous names for practically everything but these 2 pieces?

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u/gemi29 California Aug 12 '22

Roger Stone doesn't surprise me, but wonder what he's doing with regard to Macron

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u/The_OtherDouche Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

Gathering dirt for when they wanted to get Le Pen in office since she is a Russian asset.

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u/forzagoodofdapeople Aug 12 '22

Not gonna lie: if I was Putin, my "last" request of Trump would be to grab these kinds of documents for me. It's a win/win: Either you get the documents, or he gets caught and you get a massive destabilizing event in the US. Either way; great for Russia.

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u/AssassinPanda97 Pennsylvania Aug 12 '22

Various classified/TS/SCI documents

Yeah he's done for

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u/Gleeemonex Texas Aug 12 '22

That typo on item 28A must be driving whoever did it crazy. Almost made it to the end of writing up a document that will certainly be in history books, and they boffed it on the last line.

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u/ebcreasoner Washington Aug 12 '22 Wholesome

I wouldn't be surprised if the evidence in question was already labeled "Topp Secret".

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u/SandSeraph Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 13 '22 Silver Gold

For all those saying he declassified documents:

  1. Declassification is a process that requires re-issuance of documents without classification markings. Anything with classification markings is still, by definition, classified. This cannot be retroactive, removal of docs can only occur after classification has been altered.

  2. Even the president may not alter classification on certain materials. Specifically documents pertaining to nuclear secrets and intelligence sources.

  3. TS/SCI documents may not just be removed from a SCIF. Period. There is an exhaustive process involved.

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u/ninejacknine Aug 12 '22

Furthermore, nuclear RD/FRD docs must be reviewed by DoE prior to declassification, due to the Atomic Energy Act.

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/ComebackShane I voted Aug 12 '22

They act like the President can just declare something declassified like Michael Scott 'declaring' bankruptcy, and it shows just how deluded they are. They're grasping at any kind of straw to make this okay in their minds.

Meanwhile, while ignoring if he can do so, none of them are discussing should he have done so. Even if a President can so simply declassify materials, are they really okay with Trump grabbing boxfulls of Top Secret / SCI documents and taking them to his clubhouse? What do they think he's intending to do with them? Read them to reminisce?

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 13 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/PathologicalLoiterer Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 13 '22

With all these nuclear secrets rumours swirling around, I'd like to remind everyone of one of the many scandals the nation seems to have just... forgotten about. Specifically that members of Trump's administration and family were attempting to secretly sell nuclear secrets to the Saudi's during Trump's presidency.

Edit: the same Saudis that were at Mar-a-lago recently were at a Trump golf course recently (it might have been the NJ course), by the way...

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u/cavalrycorrectness Aug 12 '22

You mean the Saudis that just inexplicably hosted their first golf tournament at Trump’s golf course and paid Kushner 2billion?

Those Saudis sure love golf.

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u/Shaggy2772 Aug 12 '22

I think attempting may be upgraded to did sell now.

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u/schwol Florida Aug 12 '22

I'd be shocked if he didn't sell a lot of info already. We can just worry about how much and what specifically.

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u/charcoalist Aug 12 '22

$2 billion investment to Jared and untold millions of dollars to trump via his hotels and the LIV golf league playing on trump courses.

Classic case of espionage. Sell state secrets for personal enrichment.

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u/cleric3648 Pennsylvania Aug 12 '22

From the warrant, he's under investigation for USC 18 793 (Espionage Act), 1519 (Obstruction of Justice destruction of evidence and records), 2071 (Removal of records).

There's reports that have come out sprinkled in with these other mentions of a grand jury meeting concerning these crimes. If that's the case, someone's about to have a really bad weekend. From the bottom of my heart, let me say...

Good. Fuck that guy.

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u/plumbicdirigible Aug 12 '22

The Espionage Act violations carry up to 10 years in prison PER DOCUMENT.

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u/danielstover Aug 12 '22 Helpful

I’m not a mathematician, but that’s life in prison

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u/mattarei Aug 12 '22

To be fair, one document may well be life in prison for Trump considering his age and health

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u/billiam0202 Kentucky Aug 12 '22 hehehehe

IDK, prison food is probably healthier than anything he eats now. It might extend his life.

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u/Free_Economist Aug 12 '22

It could be life in prison or death penalty if they give defense information to a foreign government.

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u/-LetterToTheRedditor Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 13 '22 Silver Platinum Helpful All-Seeing Upvote Starry

It's important to note as Trump moves the goalposts to say he declassified every classified document seized by the FBI, the president does NOT have the ability to declassify documents that are classified by statute (like nuclear secrets and identification of intelligence operatives): https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/08/trump-fbi-raid-classified-nuclear-documents/671119/

So if Trump was in possession of classified documents related to nuclear weapons as the FBI suspected according to the Washington Post report (https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/08/11/garland-trump-mar-a-lago/), he had no authority to declassify them even as president. We do not yet know if the FBI seized any documents that fit that description.

Others have noted that the espionage statutes listed in the warrant do not explicitly require classified information in order to bring charges. "The Espionage Act predates the classification system and thus references not classified information, but 'national defense information.'"(https://www.rightsanddissent.org/news/house-rules-committee-espionage-act-whistleblowers-journalists/)

***Edited to include additional info and to fix formatting

Original Comment: https://imgur.com/a/XSnBmWd

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u/Aluminum_Falcons New Hampshire Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote Starry

In addition, for the info a president can declassify, there is a procedure that must be followed and documented. You can't declassify stuff like Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy.

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u/sack-o-matic Michigan Aug 12 '22

And it also doesn't mean he gets to keep it all to himself. Declassified means anyone can access it, not just who he chooses.

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u/__mototype__ Aug 12 '22

Yep. That’s the catch. First of all he would have had to follow procedure but the big reason for that procedure is that it then allows that document to be accessible by the public. You can’t take something classified, and the declassify it so that only you can see it. Doesn’t work that way.

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u/NeoMegaRyuMKII California Aug 12 '22

Saying he declassified it will serve only one real purpose - adding talking points to his base. They don't notice and/or don't care that the goalposts continue to move. They don't care about truth.

It is all about setting up the narrative.

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u/Noisy_Toy North Carolina Aug 12 '22

Yup. Completely not in his purview.

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u/nacholuver1 Aug 12 '22

His supporters have now moved the bar to "it's not like he was trying to sell them to another country".

Are you sure about that guys?

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u/GodOfDarkLaughter Aug 12 '22

Jared just got two BILLION from the Saudis. And for what? His investment expertise? The little shit has a history of absolutely atrocious investments. So what DID he provide them? And is it really just a funnel to his father-in-law?

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u/Aluminum_Falcons New Hampshire Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote Take My Energy Wholesome Seal of Approval Bless Up (Pro)

Holy shit. We might see a former president of the US arrested for betraying the country.

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u/2rio2 Aug 12 '22

The irony being it's likely only one of several crimes he committed in office. Just, you know, the worst one.

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u/Wiitard Aug 12 '22 Vibing Wholesome (Pro)

The worst one we know about so far.

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u/_zero_fox Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote

This is just the shit he's still holding 1.5 years after leaving office. What did he leverage/sell for the 4 years he had unquestioned, unfettered access?

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u/QuickMentality Mississippi Aug 12 '22 Silver Vibing

Couldn't happen to a better guy.

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u/AJEstes Arizona Aug 12 '22 Silver All-Seeing Upvote Starry To The Stars

I was a 35-Series MOS in the army with a TS/SCI clearance. I would be in jail forever if I did this. This is insane.

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u/BikerJedi Florida Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Ally

I only had a Secret and would have been in trouble if I took a code book for the Stinger missile I used. It is amazing to me that given he had nuclear secrets that any conservative is defending him.

EDIT: Reality Winner took one document and served four years.

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u/Rymbeld Aug 12 '22

I wish people understood how security clearances work. My clearance didn't mean I could just walk into the Pentagon and read anything I wanted

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u/AJEstes Arizona Aug 12 '22

Come on! You know as well as I do the first thing that happens when you get your clearance is they set you in front of a SIPRNET computer and tell you to just ‘go nuts!’.

The secret war between the Mole Men and Lizard People was fascinating.

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u/cal679 Aug 13 '22

At the highest level clearance they take you down to the Alien Room and you get to pick one of the aliens and they'll kill it and cook it for you right there any way you want.

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u/TintedApostle Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Helpful Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote Take My Energy Take My Power

You know I am not even feeling any level of satisfaction with this thing. It scares the heck out of me that he did this and what he might have done with our security. It bothers me that the GOP is looking for excuses instead of real answers.

It isn't a celebration. Its a disaster and betrayal of every thing American. May the name Trump and his close family which supported all this live in shame.

Let justice be swift and clear.

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u/Snufffaluffaguss Tennessee Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 13 '22

Same. This egotistical narcissist put our country, it's security, and ALL of our welfares at risk yet again. When he's not even in office.

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u/thehikingbadger Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Wholesome Take My Energy Bravo! Starry

I'm livid. This is a massive betrayal. Certainly the biggest betrayal in our country's history. This man attempted a coup to retain power and, when he was kicked out, took top secret documents with him to likely share with foreign powers.

And it frustrates me that it might not have gotten to this point if Republicans had an ounce of accountability when it came to this man's prior transgressions. Their dereliction of duty has made us all less safe.

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u/Phalanx_1157 Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote

He's trying to get FBI agents killed and cause a damn civil war. Can we please get him behind bars and take away his phone? Please.

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u/moosebaloney America Aug 12 '22

For those who don't understand this reference: Breitbart published Trump's copy of the warrant without the agents' information redacted.

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u/Illuminated12 Indiana Aug 12 '22

I'm not understanding why the FBI isn't raiding Breitbart currently. It is against the law to dox fbi agents.

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u/miloblue12 Aug 12 '22

January 6th didn't work for him, so this is his chance to finally get his base riled up enough to actually potentially do something. This is insane.

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u/HolyRamenEmperor Colorado Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Silver All-Seeing Upvote

Reminder: The National Archive (edit: quietly) demanded the return of White House records in February, which by law must go to the archives. Trump turned over 15 boxes but it was suspected he kept some. So in June they subpoenaed him for remaining documents, but he ignored it.

This is not out of nowhere. This is not a political hit. They tried to recover sensitive documents without incident, but Trump refused. This could have been avoided.

Now the DOJ says the 11 sets of classified documents include some marked Top Secret, indicating probable cause to charge Trump with violation of the Espionage Act.

If true, this is bigger than Nixon. Trump would go to prison.

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u/the_ill_buck_fifty Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote

It's always been bigger than Nixon. Since day one.

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u/pittpanthers95 Pennsylvania Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Helpful Wholesome Take My Energy hehehehe Bravo! Calculating

It’s only a matter of time before Marjorie Taylor Greene is tweeting about repealing the “ESPN Age Act”

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u/Cornerway Aug 12 '22

Fox : How espionage is good for the economy

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u/basement_vibes Aug 12 '22

Conservatives are downvoting brietbart and fox in their own safe space right now. It's hilarious to see how either insane or disengaged they are today.

That breitbart article that literally leaked the warrant current is 30% up voted with no comments!

Pure insanity!

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u/darksidemojo Aug 12 '22

Of course there is no comments they haven’t been told how far down the field they need to move the goalposts yet.

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u/DetergentOwl5 Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

Remember the backlash for Fox News when they simply announced Biden won the election? Their base lives in an alternate reality and they know it, being truthful about what's going on will cause the network and the republican party too much backlash.

They will deflect and lie into their graves.

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u/OhSeesOhMees Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Wholesome Take My Energy LOVE! Wholesome Seal of Approval Starstruck

It's never too late to change your mind or admit you were wrong, and it's perfectly okay to. I hope a lot of conservatives in this country wake up.

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u/dc5trbo Indiana Aug 12 '22 Starry

Is this it? Is this finally it? High treason. Please, sweet Ganesha, let this be it.

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u/CPUnique Aug 12 '22 Gold Helpful Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote Starry Ally Brighten My Day Wholesome (Pro)

I also choose this guy's elephant god.

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u/cipherSoreEyes Aug 12 '22

This is so much worse than what Nixon did.

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u/seven8zero Aug 12 '22 Wholesome

This is about the 200th thing Trump did that is worse than what Nixon did.

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u/4wry_reddit Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold Helpful Wholesome All-Seeing Upvote Take My Energy Bravo! Eureka! Respect
  • The fact that the FBI resorted to execute the search warrant in light of the political fallout implies that the evidence and urgency must be overwhelming
  • All other means of obtaining the requested documents quietly, e.g. via legal councils were exhausted, forcing the FBI to intervene
  • Applying for and executing the warrant personally approved by Merrick Garland, he himself had previously issued a memo requiring his personal approval of investigations into the former president
  • There was probable cause and enough evidence of a crime for a federal judge to grant the warrant
  • The top-level classified nature of these documents also entails that there is essentially zero chance that these inadvertently got mixed up with other records such as diplomatic letters or gifts (the former president does not give the impression of an avid reader in the interest of national security)
  • 15 boxes with records were previously retrieved by the National Archives, meaning that the remaining material was willfully withheld
  • The storage areas for these document are woefully negligent
  • This raises suspicions with regards to the motivations behind taking and retaining these documents, especially in light of billion-dollar investments into Jared Kushner's business or recent Golf tournaments hosted at the scene. It is highly disturbing to entertain the possibility that access to these documents was up for sale or a return on favors for foreign influences with nefarious intentions

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u/ohherroeeyore Aug 12 '22

As a government records manager, this blows my freaking mind. NARA does not fuck around. If I accidentally mishandle an organizational document, my ass is grass. Much less top secret docs, stored in an unsecured, private residence.

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u/ajmartin527 Aug 12 '22

A private residence that saudis and Russians frequent

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u/unaskthequestion Aug 12 '22

meaning the remaining material was willfully withheld

I don't think it's possible to to interpret this fact as anything other than intent to violate the law.

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u/Alternative-Ninja-50 Aug 12 '22

/r/conservative is genuinely concerning. Group psychosis almost.

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u/Ok_Fold9486 New York Aug 12 '22

Imagine being brainwashed to insurmountable truths in favor of Alex Jones

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u/Dwightu1gnorantslut Aug 12 '22

I agree. It used to be kind of funny and now it's deeply disturbing. I can't wrap my head around it, how did THIS man get this many people to want to literally die for him?

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u/Popular_Syllabubs Aug 12 '22

They have to play hackey-sack with their singular brain cell just to struggle a cohesive thought together

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u/-MarcoTraficante Aug 12 '22 All-Seeing Upvote

Florida Man charged in sale of state secrets

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u/simfoe Aug 12 '22 Silver

Thinking about it, man, the 2020's have been absolutely fucking nuts.

Worldwide pandemic, War in Europe, Coup attempt, former President steals classified information. We're only two years in. I think I might have aged 50 years by 2030.

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u/Gishin Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

2A- Various classified/TS/SCI documents.

That stands for Top Secret / Sensitive Compartmented Information. By definition, this is information that would cause exceptionally grave damage to national security if it were leaked and likely reveals our intelligence collection sources.

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u/NewPepper1580 Aug 12 '22

And not allowed out of specific secured locations.

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u/hot4preacher Aug 12 '22

For months we've been waiting for the big bombshell to drop from the Jan. 6th Committee, then Garland drops an RKO outta nowhere.

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u/TintedApostle Aug 12 '22

Jan 6th isn't even finished.

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u/swenau01 Aug 12 '22 Wholesome

This week has been so crazy, I honestly forgot about how J6 committee has the contents of Alex Jones’s phone!

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u/Daniiiiii I voted Aug 12 '22

Imagine if Jan6 committee is just a footnote in Trump's criminal history because he will be charged with soooo much worse now. Amazing.

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u/CarlosFer2201 Foreign Aug 12 '22 Gold

Extorting Zelenzky should have been enough.
Heck, all the obstruction of justice in the Mueller report should have been enough.

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u/hot4preacher Aug 12 '22

Nor is the Fulton County investigation.

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u/somethingbreadbears Aug 12 '22

What's dumb is Trump could've just returned the documents when they asked and we wouldn't know a thing about it.

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u/hot4preacher Aug 12 '22 Gold Helpful Take My Energy

What's dumb is Trump could've just returned the documents when they asked and we wouldn't know a thing about it.

FTFY

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u/dwors025 Minnesota Aug 12 '22

Get absolutely fucked, magaworld.

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u/ExRays Colorado Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

Lol he is under criminal investigation for

  1. Violating the Espionage Act
  2. Obstruction of Justice
  3. Criminal handling of government records.
  • 1 set of records was marked Top Secret/SCI
  • 3 sets were marked Top Secret
  • 4 sets were marked Secret
  • 3 sets were marked confidential.

Some of the sets allegedly contained information on nuclear capabilities.

Trump is FUCKED

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u/Tastypies Aug 12 '22

The real question is: Are WE fucked? If these documents are as top secret as we think they are, and Trump has already sold some of the information to countries like Russia or Saudi Arabia, what does that mean for us?

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u/Eman5805 Aug 12 '22

What if this was the plan all along? To give away government secrets to Russia or the Saudis?

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u/Nvnv_man Georgia Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

Why the “but he declassified” argument fails to mitigate culpability:

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u/piponwa Canada Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Silver

Guys, realize how historic this is. They would have never done the raid if they were not 100% confident that they would find what they have found. They would have never done that if they didn't 100% intend to charge him in the first place.

The fact that we have confirmation that they seized Top Secret documents and SCI documents is the proof that he'll be charged. Because that's the statute used to justify the search.

Likely the last bit of info they needed to charge him. There may be more for a second round, but my guess is this is it boys and girls.

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u/BuffaloKiller937 Aug 12 '22

Thank you! I feel like a lot are missing the big picture here. The FBI will sit until they are 100% sure they have a firm grip on you.

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u/redalertz2 Aug 12 '22

Violating the Espionage Act Obstruction of Justice Criminal handling of government records. 1 set of records was marked Top Secret/SCI 3 sets were marked Top Secret 4 sets were marked Secret 3 sets were marked confidential. Some of the sets allegedly contained information on nuclear capabilities.

Trump is FUCKED

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u/CallRespiratory Aug 12 '22

Reminder that Trump's son in law just got like two billion dollars from Saudi Arabia. Can't help but wonder if that's in any way related to classified nuclear documents.

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u/kinenbi New Mexico Aug 12 '22 Helpful

r/conservative in full denial mode. "But her emails", right? "But Hunter's laptop." "But but but but but but but".

I feel so vindicated. Conservatives in power who supported this shit are traitors. Them and Trump deserve a traitor's fate.

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u/HotSpicedChai Aug 12 '22 Silver

Just checked out that sub, every comment goes like this.

“If it’s true, which it isn’t, but if it might be true, but we know it’s not, then I may feel that he might deserve punishment, which he doesn’t”

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u/bensefero Oregon Aug 12 '22

It’s coping in real time

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u/Rion23 Aug 12 '22

They cope by saying they are being brigaded.

Flaired users only

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 23 '22

[deleted]

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u/Toad_With_Yeti_Pubes Aug 12 '22

Republicans became the espionage party today. They were already the insurrection party, but now they're the espionage party, too. All for this grifting con man. Bunch of pathetic assholes, the lot of them.

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u/boundbylife Indiana Aug 12 '22

So lemme get this straight:

Trump beefed up the penalty for improperly handling classified documents. FBI finds classified documents improperly handled at a Trump facility.

This is the slammiest slam dunk anyone could ever get.

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u/Hoopae I voted Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Silver All-Seeing Upvote

All of the items siezed:

Item
1 - Executive Grant of Clemency re: Roger Jason Stone, Jr.
1A - Info re : President of France
2 - Leather-bound box of documents
2A - Various classified/TS/SCI documents
3 - Potential Presidential Record
4 - Documents
5 - Binder of photos
6 - Binder of photos
7 - Handwritten note
8 - Box labeled A-1
9 - Box labeled A-12
10 - Box Labeled A-15
10A - Miscellaneous Secret Documents
11 - Box Labeled A-16
11A - Miscellaneous Top Secret Documents
12 - Box labeled A-17
13 - Box labeled A-18
13A - Miscellaneous Top Secret Documents
14 - Box labeled A- 27
14A - Miscellaneous Confidential Documents
15 - Box Labeled A-28
15A- Miscellaneous Secret Documents
16 - Box labeled A-30
17 - Box labeled A-32
18 - Box labeled A-35
19 - Box labeled A-23
19A - Confidential Document
20 - Box Labeled A-22
21 - Box labeled A-24
22 - Box Labeled A-34
23 - Box Labeled A-39
23A - Miscellaneous Secret Documents
24 - Box labeled A-40
25 - Box Labeled A-41
25A - Miscellaneous Confidential Documents
26 - Box Labeled A- 42
26A - Miscellaneous Top Secret Documents
27 - Box Labeled A-71
28 - Box Labeled A-73
28A - Miscellaneous Top Secret Documents
29 - Box labeled A-14
30 - Box Labeled A-26
31 · Box Labeled A-43
32 - Box Labeled A-13
33 - Box Labeled A-33

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u/m4a2000 Washington Aug 12 '22

Miscellaneous Top Secret Documents

That phrase alone, used NINE TIMES, is just unbelievable.

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u/SuperSimpleSam Aug 12 '22

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u/LeFopp Aug 12 '22

This is the one he won’t be able to escape from, no matter how hard him and his supporters try to fight it.

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u/LakersBroncoslove Aug 12 '22

How did he get it out of the SCIF? Better question is who took it out of the SCIF for him? That person or persons would likely candidates for an immunity deal. They could even be the informant who was working with the FBI before the search.

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u/go_comatose_for_me Aug 12 '22

Let's not pretend the GOP cares at all about SCIF security.

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u/GhazelleBerner Aug 12 '22 Gold Helpful All-Seeing Upvote

Hey, Conservatives:

Please admit it: If Obama did this, you'd be calling for his head on a spike.

Please admit it: What Hillary Clinton did was several orders of magnitude less serious than this.

Just admit it: You have a double standard.

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u/jafomatic Texas Aug 12 '22

That would require also "admit it: you're not the good guys."

That's the dealbreaker.

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u/MNfan84 Aug 12 '22

That's the thing, they aren't even trying to be the good guys anymore. They actively enjoy being cruel

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u/PrincipledInelegance Michigan Aug 12 '22

If you don't even draw the line at espionage, you're in dire need of cult deprogramming

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u/DuePrize5 Aug 12 '22 Silver

r/conservative tomorrow:

"Donald Trump has been replaced by three ANTIFAS in a trenchcoat!"

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u/GilmoreSquirls Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

My boss' first instinct was to speculate about the FBI planting them because it would be impossibly stupid to store them at his house

Imagine following someone so stupid your cognitive dissonance convinces you its not possible and something else must be going on

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u/DanManF1 United Kingdom Aug 12 '22

Republicans in a few minutes: “Violating the Espionage Act is a totally patriotic thing to do!”

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u/ThePresbyter New Jersey Aug 12 '22

"He had to do this to stop the Deep State and MAGA"

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u/ASlockOfFeagulls California Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

So...who had "The LIV Tournament is a front for nuclear espionage committed by Trump for the Saudis" on their bingo card at the start of the week?

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u/NeilPoonHandler Pennsylvania Aug 12 '22

All I want for Christmas is for Trump to be officially charged and arrested this weekend.

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u/RealUncleBuck District Of Columbia Aug 12 '22

CNN Reporting: The official release of the warrant made sure to redact the names of the agents involved in the search to protect them from radicals.

The right-wing media that leaked the warrant early did not redact their names.

Now they are facing various threats against their, and their families' lives.

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u/coocoocoonoicenoice Aug 12 '22

1) It is impossible for an individual who can read not to know a document is top secret. They are meticulously and redundantly labeled.

2) Top secret documents have a viewing procedure even for authorized individuals which involves access through a secure facility.

3) No individual other than Donald Trump could conceivably have the power/ability to remove these documents.

4) Donald Trump was aware of the fact that he had top secret documents in his possession and that this possession was unauthorized. The feds subpoenaed these documents months ago, so he clearly knew he shouldn't have them.

Given the above, it is clear that Trump willfully violated federal statute regarding handling of these documents. This should be an open and shut case.

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u/rdking647 Aug 12 '22 Helpful

at the very least his passport should be immediately cancelled, he should be arrested and given an ankle monitor.
he is a flight risk

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u/mountaintop111 Aug 12 '22 Ally

Oh wow, some of the comments in r/conservative now are looking more reasonable today?

Here is one comment I read that had a high upvote:

Well that explains alot. If this is true and everything checks out trump is in trouble. As conservative’s though we should all want the truth even if it’s brutal which seems highly possible now.

Edit: for everyone sending me messages and hate if you truly are against punishing people who commit legit crimes even if you’re a supporter you’re part of the problem ALSO im not saying he definitely did this or is guilty just saying if he is he should be held accountable

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u/veringer Tennessee Aug 12 '22

I assume that user has been banned by now?

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u/mountaintop111 Aug 12 '22

No, that user actually posted the thread, in addition to making the comment. It's a flaired user.

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u/KatanaAmerica Aug 12 '22

The ex-president of the United States is under investigation for espionage. Holy shit.

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u/danishjuggler21 Aug 12 '22

Unfortunately, his corruption is so outlandish that it makes it easy for the Republicans to convince their base that it’s a lie.

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u/Graphics_Nerd America Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

He's basically been shot down already by every new statement he's made in very short order:

This was an illegal search - nope

They're planting evidence - nope

We didn't get to watch - nope

They could have asked - did

What about Obamas 33 mil docs - sorted

They were already de-classified - nope

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u/ehoyle73 Arizona Aug 12 '22

But, but Hunter's laptop!

Benghazi! E-mails!! All the other GOP buzzword talking points!! It's totally the same thing, guys! Oh yeah, Obama's middle name is Hussein!!

-- every GOP apologist in the world right now.

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u/CupcakesAreTasty Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

It's important to point out for perspective:

The evidence against Ethel Rosenberg was less than the physical evidence taken from Trump. And we executed her. For violating the same laws Trump is suspected of having violated.

This is not a nothing burger.

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u/IceciroAvant I voted Aug 12 '22

To be fair it came out later we had much more evidence for the Rosenbergs than we showed at trial, we just kept it secret to not tip off the Soviets we had broken their ciphers.

But your point stands.

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u/UpUpDnDnLRLRBAstart California Aug 12 '22

I’m assuming the same is very possible for Trump. If he’s already sold secrets, the government likely knows but doesn’t want to show their hand to foreign nations.

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u/summerlull Aug 12 '22

Lmao r/conservative in absolute shambles right now. The copium of ‘he’s allowed to declassify whatever he wants!’ is just astounding.

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u/xaveria Aug 12 '22

You don’t declassify things by mumbling “I declassify thee” as you tuck them into your trousers. There’s an official process.

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u/Kevin-W Aug 12 '22

To understand how serious the Espionage Act is since it's one of the crimes Trump is being investigated for, it's one of the highest violations of federal law one can commit and basically one step below treason.

Trump being indicted for violation of the Espionage Act would be one of the biggest news stories of the century, let alone the trial of the century.

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u/DarkandStormy614 Ohio Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

Person. Woman. Man. Camera. Felony.

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u/EatRocksAndBleed Aug 12 '22

people over on r/conservative have taken Trumps bait. They’re talking about ‘HiLLaRyS EmAiLs’ and how ‘ObAmA tOoK dOcS.’ They can’t be swayed. The issue of radical conservative politics and ideology doesn’t die with Trump. Vote in November.

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u/n3ws4cc Aug 12 '22 Take My Energy

To everyone saying he'll get away with it. If the Wapo sources are right: his is treason of the highest order. Think beyond this being a procedural fuck up. Think of what this means for national security. If information like that ends up in the hands of the wrong people. What Putin, Xi, Kim, the Saudi's and god knows who would do for that informatio. Understand that nuclear deterrence is a cornerstone of national security and understand that it might've been completely breached and/or, god forbid, straight up sold. It literally doesn't get worse than that. The US executed spies for that with less evidence. He's officially the biggest criminal in the history of the US.

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u/SanchitoQ Aug 12 '22

I’ve heard Hillary mentioned on Fox today more than I have in the last 6 years.

Did I miss an alternate timeline where Hillary was President?

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u/Shaggy2772 Aug 12 '22

Just for edification: The argument from Trump and conservatives that former Presidents have taken or transferred plenty of documents fails to mention that they did so THROUGH THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES to ensure that THIS didnt happen.

Moron.

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u/NotTheCraftyVeteran Aug 12 '22

First member of the WWE Hall of Fame facing charges for violating the Espionage Act. Tremendous. Sports entertainment history being made every day!

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u/bmanCO Colorado Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Take My Energy

Conservatives are actually going to double down on attaching themselves to the sinking ship of this unfathomably stupid, worthless pile of shit with no redeeming qualities. It's amazing to watch in real time. It's like scientists created a lab experiment to design the most useless sack of barely sentient human garbage imaginable, then American conservatives looked at the result of their work and said "yep, I'm going to dedicate my entire life to religiously worshiping this man." These fucking people actually wield real political power in this country. Incredible.

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u/StromWashington Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

For anybody still questioning: Trump will be indicted for this. The DOJ doesn't unseal info until there is nothing left to investigate.

They then either drop the case if they feel the grand jury won't indict, or bring charges against their investigation's target. Which path does Garland seem to be taking, based on yesterday's press conference?

Writing is on the wall, at this point. Charges of espionage will be brought against a former President of the United States. Can't wait for the trial. Happy F5 Friday, yall.

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u/Oleg101 Aug 12 '22

And look: his lawyer did get a copy, unlike what GOP and right wing pundits said.

https://twitter.com/balzer_jess/status/1558179076350754816?s=21&t=1VPa6db8CldBqCYGB0Ghog

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u/theshillshavepies Georgia Aug 12 '22

Really hoping we get an OJ Bronco moment, in this case it’ll be Trump and his golf cart

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u/coys21 Aug 12 '22

I bet he yelled "I declassify these documents," like Michael Scott declared bankruptcy.

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u/Gator1508 Aug 12 '22

The ironic thing about r conservative is that they often claim “liberals” are like children who don’t understand how the real world works. Yet you spend two seconds on their forum and you see they think life operates like a TV show.

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u/Icy-Tooth-9167 Aug 12 '22

I was a technical surveillance countermeasures specialist in the Marines. Basically, any space that rated SCI (it’s usually TS if its SCI) rates routine surveillance countermeasure support to ensure there is no one installing sneaky devices to gain access to highly classified information. Usually it’s foreign adversaries we are worried about, not a former POTUS. LOL. I doubt Trump was safeguarding any of this information. Therefore, we might as well assume everything he was in possession of has been compromised. This means sources, methods, classified programs, etc. Just the breach alone is astounding and would put any normal person in jail for many years. Who knows what he was actually doing with the information. I hope we find out.

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u/TrooperJohn Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Silver Narwhal Salute

This is a watershed event in American history.

If Trump survives THIS, the American experiment is effectively done. Some vestigial elements of democracy will remain for awhile, but it would just be too much a body blow to the whole idea of constitutional government in the US.

If Trump winds up paying heavily for this (in whatever way: prison, his followers (finally) dumping him, utter across-the-board disgrace), then we have some hope that we can begin the process of turning fascism back into the fringe movement it's been for most of our history.

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u/sithjustgotreal66 Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Helpful

Just a reminder that this is only happening because enough people voted blue in 2018 and 2020 for there to be an Attorney General who isn't a Trump sycophant. Elections matter (for now)

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u/Jaf207 Georgia Aug 12 '22

Republicans have no one to blame but themselves for “dividing the country”. You guys are the ones who choose this piece of shit and defend every dumb or malicious thing he does has done for the past 7 years.

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u/11711510111411009710 Texas Aug 12 '22

It feels pretty nice to have been right about trump all this time. I wonder how my trump supporting father is reacting to this.

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u/lambofgun Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22

i love the "what about hunter's laptop!!!!???". im over here alright like arrest him too if he broke the law idgaf

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u/Whoopziedaisy West Virginia Aug 12 '22 Silver

The DOJ is aiming at Treasanous Trump right between the eyes. The publicity of the warrant, property list, and events is to socialize the news to the American public before the impending indictment. They will indict him within a few weeks. The recovered docs are physical evidence of crimes he has already committed. It does not ask new questions, it provides more answers. It's not new information, it's icing on the cake. They asked for materials back while already aware of how he was using them. Treasonous Trump's game is officially up.

Greed is the banality of evil, my fellow Americans.

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u/scycon Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Gold Platinum

And now /r/conservative has moved on to excusing the behavior by saying as president he has authority to declassify material at any time and not tell anybody that he has declassified it.

That’s. Not. How. It. Works.

There are actual procedures to declassify information so that people working within our government ACTUALLY KNOW HOW THEY NEED TO HANDLE IT. Holy fucking shit.

It’s true that the president can declassify information at any time, but the president can’t mishandle classified information, get caught after he’s no longer president still mishandling it, and say he waved his hand over the documents while he was still president declassifying them as he carried them out of the building without telling anybody so it’s all good.

Come the fuck on people. I am just so fucking sick of this goddamn cult of assholes wrecking our country and excusing the absolute worst behaviors of a president who has zero good qualities about him other than he’s so fucking narcissistic and stupid that he’s bad at hiding his wrongdoing and scheming from the public.

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u/Marathon2021 Aug 12 '22 Silver

From the Bloomberg analysis, of course Donnie is saying he waved his magic sharpie over everything before it went out the door ...

“Number one, it was all declassified,” Trump said. “Number two, they didn’t need to ‘seize’ anything. They could have had it anytime they wanted without playing politics and breaking into Mar-a-Lago. It was in secured storage, with an additional lock put on as per their request.”

No, Donnie - it was not all declassified. And if there is anything nuclear in there, even you couldn't have declassified it. And #2, yes the National Archives did ask. Once in person. Once with a subopena. You basically told them to fuck off each time.

That shows consciousness of guilt. That removes any "oh, I didn't know" defense you might have hoped to mount.

You're fucked, dude. Lock. Him. Up.

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u/nfgchick79 Aug 12 '22 Spit-take

I bought a special bottle of celebration wine earlier because I got a new job. Welp. I already opened it. Fucking A.

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u/beer_30 Aug 12 '22

This makes one wonder why the Saudis gave Jared Kushner 2 Billion dollars 6 months after Trump left office.

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u/El_Rey_de_Spices Aug 12 '22

"I.... DECLARE.... DECLASSIFICATION!"

"It doesn't work like that. You can't just say the documents are declassified."

"I didn't say it, I declared it!"

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u/miraj31415 Aug 12 '22

Analysis by emptywheel shows exactly how the fact pattern matches the crime of 18 USC § 793(e):

Did the defendant, without authorization, have possession of, access to, or control over a document that was National Defense Information?

Yes. The Archives spent a year telling him he was not authorized to have it under the Presidential Records Act.

Did the document in question relate to the national defense?

We don’t know what the documents in question are, but given WaPo’s description in February, then absolutely.

Bonus fact: The jury decides if something was NDI, not the former Original Classification Authority (the fancy term for, “the President gets to decide whether something is classified or not”). So if the agency whose document Trump stole is still trying to protect it from hostile powers, if that agency still believes it is classified, if it remains secret, then a jury is likely to find that it’s NDI.

Did the defendant have reason to believe the information could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation?

Trump is such a psychopath that the answer to this might normally be in question. After all, he routinely treated top secret intelligence like it was toilet paper or party favors for visiting Russians.

Except DOJ went to Trump’s residence in June and told him this information could harm the US. Then they wrote him a letter, saying that it could harm the US and could he please put a padlock on the basement room that had, up until that point, been accessible to all the suspected foreign assets who’ve paid the price of admission to Mar-a-Lago.

Did the defendant retain the above material and fail to deliver it to the officer or employee of the United States entitled to receive it?

Yes! The Archives asked and asked and asked. And then DOJ went to his home and asked again!

Did he keep this document willfully?

Yup. Again, DOJ asked and asked and asked. Trump exhibited awareness the Archives were asking. He stopped in to say “hi!” when Jay Bratt, the head of DOJ’s espionage section, came to visit. And he still hoarded the document.

This may be why Trump claims that nothing was in the hotel safe in his bridal suite, by the way. Keeping these documents at Mar-a-Lago was willful by itself. But keeping such documents in his safe would be proof that he, personally, was hoarding it.

If the FBI really did scoop up highly sensitive documents when they were at Mar-a-Lago the other day, then there may be relatively few steps left to charging him — aside from cataloging the 12 new boxes of stolen documents. DOJ may only need permission from the agencies that own these documents to make the declassifications required to prosecute it.

By going to Mar-a-Lago and asking for these documents in person on June 3, DOJ made it very easy to prove that Trump had been asked, but refused, to give any classified documents found in Trump’s possession on Monday back.

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u/lasers42 Aug 12 '22 Silver Gold

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I’m just a caveman. I fell on some ice and later got thawed out by some of your scientists. Your world frightens and confuses me! Sometimes the honking horns of your traffic make me want to get out of my BMW.. and runoff into the hills, or wherever.. Sometimes when I get a message on my fax machine, I wonder: “Did little demons get inside and type it?” I don’t know! My primitive mind can’t grasp these concepts. But there is one thing I do know – when a man like my client slips and takes some top secret information from the US government, it's his constitutional right to shop it out to the highest bidder.

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u/sithjustgotreal66 Aug 12 '22 Helpful

He could have lived out his whole life just enjoying the trappings of wealth and telling people on TV that they're fired, but Obama tells one joke that gets under his skin at a WH dinner and now he might become the first president to go to jail. Thanks Obama

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u/nomofica Aug 12 '22

Greatest use of Thanks Obama I've ever seen

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u/ShowerCurtainRings Aug 12 '22

Well, libs… are you owned yet?

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u/zhaoz Minnesota Aug 12 '22

If it is legitimate espionage, the justice system has ways to shut the whole thing down.

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u/Onbusinesstrips Aug 12 '22

I just popped into r/conservative to check it out. Right to Hilary.. wasn’t she grilled for 11 hours straight and nothing was found? Saying Obama took 30k or million documents.. which was debunked by the national archives today. I don’t understand it, I cannot comprehend how people can become so blinded. I get there is a lack of trust in the government and for good reason. I do think a lot needs to change but to latch on and defend him like they are.

I don’t understand cults

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u/MDC6189089 Maryland Aug 12 '22

Weirdly, Trump has not testified for any of the things levied against him during his presidency. Almost like he's a spineless, guilty fucking coward.

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u/BabyYodaX America Aug 12 '22

Take a shot of alcohol each time someone on Fox mentions Hillary Clinton/Hunter Biden/ Obama tonight. Good luck.

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u/tyrael459 Aug 12 '22

Man, that Graham quote about Trump destroying the Republican Party as we know it seems pretty eerie right about now.

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u/AutomaticAutomatica Aug 12 '22

This makes watergate look like a parking ticket

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u/Poopedinbed Aug 12 '22

R/Conservatives for flaired users only haha

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u/ozeor Aug 12 '22

Here is everything that was taken from the warrant. You guys really should be reading this list....It's pretty damning.

https://www.scribd.com/document/586754620/EXCLUSIVE-Warrant-and-Property-Receipt-from-Mar-a-Lago-Raid

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u/Nitackit Aug 12 '22

Donnie is gassing up the jet for a rally in Alaska, and he may overshoot his landing by a few hundred miles.

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u/HereForTwinkies Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 13 '22 Silver Evil Cackle

MAGA world is saying DeSantis was behind the whole thing. The GoP may actual have a civil war between DeSantis and Maga folk.
Edit; Which I may get Listen, I’m not saying Ron DeSantis ordered the raid or blew the whistle. I’m just saying the judge that signed off on it lives in Ron’s state. Mar-A-Largo is in Ron’s state so he has plenty of connections. Ron has been losing in the polls consistently to Trump. Less than 24 hours before the raid DeSantis suddenly says he is going to travel out of state to campaign for people Trump endorsed. I’m not saying DeSantis worked with Tucker Carlson to turn Trump in either. I’m just saying Carlson and DeSantis were seen with Trump the week before the raid. I’m just saying out of all the weeks for Carlson to be on “vacation” it happens to be the week of the raid. I’m just saying Tucker didn’t make any comments on social media during the raid, which is odd for him. I’m just saying the guy who is covering for Tucker is a terrible host and even Hannity had trouble standing him.
I’m not saying there are a lot of things about DeSantis and Carlson that are fishy.

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u/rednaturaldisaster Aug 12 '22

That is possible one of the better possible outcomes

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u/Boxy310 Aug 12 '22

You know shit's fucked when they start stabbing literally everyone in the back on the way out the door, just for consistency's sake

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u/The_Patriot Aug 12 '22

Put that on pay-per-view and we can eliminate the national debt

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u/HolyRamenEmperor Colorado Aug 12 '22 edited Aug 12 '22 Take My Power

They didn't need to 'seize' anything. They could have had it anytime they wanted without playing politics and breaking into Mar-a-Lago.

Uh, they asked nicely in Feb, but you held back. So they subpoenaed you in June, which you ignored.

This is your fault. And because you were so mad about Hillary's emails, you made this a felony with 5 years in prison. Not to mention the DoJ believes you've also violated the Espionage Act, which comes with 10-20 years.

edit: changed "Hillary" to "Hillary's emails"

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